#165 - Flight Decks, Financial Freedom, and the Pilot Community with Dylan and Max of 21.Five

[00:00:00] You know, the one thing that pilots talk to us most about is paying too much in taxes. And as income's gone up, taxes have gone up. And so we talk about this on the show all the time. But we're actually going to dive deep into how pilots can execute tax mitigation strategies and investment tactics alike at our Passive Income Pilots Conference. Tait, when are we going to have it this year?

[00:00:24] It's in Las Vegas, Nevada on October 8th and 9th. Everybody's going to fly in on the 7th. It's going to be a jam packed two days of sessions with expert panels and over 250 of your colleagues who are like minded professionals who are looking for those exact same tax mitigation strategies. Join us in Las Vegas. It's going to be an absolute blast. So if you want tickets, go to PassiveIncomePilots.com or you can go to the link in the show notes. But with that, let's get to the show.

[00:00:56] Welcome to Passive Income Pilots, where pilots upgrade their money. This is the definitive source for personal finance and investment tactics for aviators. We interview world-renowned experts and share these lessons with the flying community. So if you're ready for practical knowledge and insights, let's roll.

[00:01:16] Hey, everyone. Welcome back to a very special episode of Passive Income Pilots. We have Max and Dylan from the 21.5 podcast today. And you can actually listen to this podcast on either platform. It's hosted this week on Passive Income Pilots as well as the 21.5 podcast. So with that, Dylan, Max, thanks for joining us. Yeah, thanks for having us, man. Happy to be here.

[00:01:38] It's one thing to meet another pilot, immediately connect with them and be obsessed with telling them that you're a pilot as well. Right? The old joke. But then when you hear it, when you meet two pilots that also have a podcast, you're like, man, I got to meet these guys. I got to talk to these guys. That's right. And you guys have had, what, over 300 episodes on your podcast? We're getting there. I think we just did 213 the other day. And we just hit a million downloads. So that was our big... Wow.

[00:02:07] ...our big milestone. So we were happy to achieve that. And it's been quite a journey so far. And no one left behind here. So if you're listening to this podcast and you're like, what is 21.5 and its significance? If you're not an airline guy or a pilot, 1.21.5 is the emergency frequency that pilots monitor and listen to. You're on board. You may have recalled maybe a month ago there was some pilots meowing on 21.5. And that made, for some reason, that made national news.

[00:02:38] Yeah. Because that's the first time that's happened. Exactly. So the name was kind of, if you know, you know, you know, that was kind of where we're going for something that if you're a professional pilot, you would know what that means. Well, I like it really. Well, with that, we'd love to hear more about your backgrounds and more about the show. Well, I guess I'll go first. So Dylan and I actually both went to Embry-Riddle for college. So that's where we learned to fly and where we kind of met.

[00:03:07] Go Eagles. Yeah. Go Eagles. And we flight instructed there. And then I had a short stint at the regional for about a year. Commuting to Chicago from Phoenix is miserable. And so then I flew corporate, you know, flew for a professional golfer and flew some other bunch of people that had a great time and flew all over the world and stuff. And then I decided I had to grow up and get a real job, as I said, because of the stability and the retirement and all this stuff at the airlines, you know.

[00:03:37] And so I went to the airlines and then during COVID, we had this extended time off program at my airline where they're like, yeah, I got this email and never forget. I read it. I'm like, wait a minute. So you're going to pay me like 65% of my guarantee to not show up and still accrue vacation and 401k and sick time and everything.

[00:04:05] Just like if I had to go, but I didn't have to show up anymore. And I was like, that's a pretty good deal. Yes. And the crazy part is they didn't do it in seniority order. Like you couldn't bid that. They did that from the junior guy to the on up. Well, it was a cent. No, but it wasn't. It was not forced. It was all voluntary. And anyone that got it. So it was just like, oh, yeah, you just picked six months, one year, two year, three year or five year. I'm like, I will take five years. Thank you. Wow. And so, and I had already had this authorization for outside flying through my airline.

[00:04:35] So then I took that deal and started flying corporate again. And then that lasted about a year and a half and they make you come back before your, I was like, wait, no. You said five years. You said five years. Deal's a deal. But yeah, so I came back and ended up just kind of working out. I think it's a unique thing with the corporate flying that I do and the schedule there and my airline and the schedule flexibility and how that all works. And so now I do both kind of.

[00:05:05] Incredible. Not kind of. I mean, I do. And then and fly smaller planes, too. So nice. Just always flying, you know, can't get enough. And it's our number one listener email we get is, oh, Max does both. I'd like to do both, too. And if you're if you're listening to this thinking that sounds great, I'll do both. That's very narrow set of circumstances to make that happen. That's very outside of the norm, I would say.

[00:05:33] People also don't realize kind of what it I mean, I know it's outside the norm, but it also it's like a lot of work to kind of keep up with both sometimes. I mean, I know you realize you're like grounded on the one airline and flying on the other. But some people will kind of overlook how much work it is to actually do like moonlighting, like real moonlighting. It's it's a commitment. And people think they want to do that, but then they get into it and they're kind of like, actually, I don't like this at all. Yeah, it can be it can be very strong. Like I said, most of the time I can make it work fairly, you know, harmoniously. But sometimes it's very stressful.

[00:06:02] You know, a few times a year. What I say is like worlds collide and I'm like, oh, let me do. But but, you know, I don't know. Figure it out. Awesome. Well, we're talking before the before we hit record that I couldn't remember how to file an IFR flight plan the last time I needed to in the Bonanza for the life of me. I couldn't figure out how to do that. So how long did it take you to figure out how to file a flight plan again after after working for the airlines? Well, I'd only I'd only been I mean, I had been flying corporate all the way up until that point.

[00:06:31] So I was still pretty fresh. It was only like, yeah, like first year when I started doing again. And plus, I've flown smaller planes, too. So I was I was still still up on the GA. But yeah, you can get rusty quick. Yeah, you can. I remember even I did a trip with a flex jet pilot once and even them. They're the same thing. Well, how do we do this? What's next? When does the paperwork get handed to me? You know, yeah. Where's the silver platter? Yeah, exactly.

[00:06:58] Do you do a teardrop downwind entry for the 45 downwind or do you do you know, do you just go straight in? You know, what's what's what do you really do? It's like, yeah. Yeah, we get spoiled at the airlines. Well, speaking of filing flight plans, Dylan, what about your background? You know, very similar to Max also in temporary riddle and then flight instructed went to the regional airlines and also realized that that was not for me. And I'm still in Never Neverland because I went to corporate flying and I've just refused to grow up and get it. What do you call it, Max? An adult job? Big boy job? I can't remember.

[00:07:29] Yeah. Just grow up and get a real job. Real job. Yeah. No, I'm still still in corporate. Really enjoy it. You know, it's it is different. And and I think there's some scenarios where it does make sense for folks to do long term. I think the airlines typically are the right choice for a lot of people. But there are certainly scenarios where where the corporate path can make sense. I think if you live in a big city, I think there's probably about I don't know, would you say seven or eight cities, Max, in the US?

[00:07:58] You can really live in Phoenix, Dallas, L.A., Miami, New York, Denver. Houston. Some of those maybe Houston. I would add Houston to the list now. Some of those big cities where there's just a lot of business jets and you can, you know, yeah, you may be getting a new job every five or six years. But there's a lot of different opportunities. And I think that's what it makes sense. I think a lot of people get burned in corporate when they're, you know, they live in the small town, you know, Medford, Oregon or something.

[00:08:28] And then the two airplanes on the field, one of them goes and then that makes it really tough. So there are snares where it makes sense. I will tell you what, though, the greatest job in aviation is the part 91 low utilization, 100 hours a year flying job. Like that is, that is, that is an awesome, awesome gig.

[00:08:51] And there are some of those, you know, you guys in the airlines may not be aware, but there's also some of these like unicorn jobs where these dudes are making, you know, five or 600 grand a year. Plus like you're set up for life mechanisms from some of these, you know, usually owners that the net worth starts with a B, but like the just, you know, and they're just wanting, they want to be a lot of money. They want their, they're pilots and they don't want them to go anywhere ever. Right.

[00:09:19] And so they're like, look, I'm going to pay you a ton now. And like when you retire from me, you'll be fine forever. Like, and there's some of those kids too, right? Cause everybody always thinks, you know, it's all, it's all about the dollars and cents. When you look at the, the, you know, the, the 401k at the airlines and the pay rates that we have now and all that stuff. But there's still some of these jobs out there that, you know, will put us to shame over the longterm. You know, it's crazy. Your network is always your net worth. Right.

[00:09:49] And so if you're connected with a billionaire, who's, who's got a nice cushy gig and you do well by them and they're going to probably make sure that you're going to do well. And, um, you know, usually the respect is there, right? They know that, you know, you're, you know, a person that has a life as well. And that, you know, you know, there's going to be some heads ups and some notice and it's not some crappy, you know, 135 on demand, you know, that's like kind of throwing you around. Right. When you're all building hours. I mean, it's, it's, uh, you know, it could be really lucrative.

[00:10:18] I mean, it can, and it's mostly it's, it's, it's about, uh, I think when you're a corporate pilot, you have to figure out what value you provide. Right. Right. It's more than, than, you know, hopping in the jet and flying from point A to point B. There's a lot more to that sphere of providing value to that person. That's, that's cutting your check. And that's where you can, um, I think you can do well is if you, if you can provide a lot of value to get to the top tier kind of thing where people value that and are willing to pay.

[00:10:45] Well, before we get off this subject, uh, I would actually like to ask for anybody that's out there listening and thinking, you know, I do have a lot of time off of my airline job and I wouldn't mind picking up an extra gig and making some extra money. How would someone go about getting a corporate job? Something like that on the side. Well, the first stop is the FOM at your carrier. Right. Right. And you figure it, cause that's the rules. Like those are your boundaries, right?

[00:11:11] It's going to tell you, you know, specify a bunch of things, how much you can fly per month. Uh, what are the duty required reporting requirements? You know, all of that stuff. There's a lot. What can you, can you do 135 or can you only do part 91? You know, all that. So that's the first stop. Right. And, and I think every airline is different. Yeah. Well, first read the book. Cause that's also his, that's his boundaries too. Right. As we all know that everything in the airlines is, is what the book says there's.

[00:11:37] And it's pretty well defined for the most part, like everything, every step of the way from the walk around to your outside flying abilities. And so, so that's the first step, you know, figure out what bounds you can. And then I don't know, Dylan, why don't you talk about the, uh, it's, it's tough. You know, you're probably going to have to know somebody, honestly, that's, that's the easy answer. It's, and, and most people that talk about it, that, that say they want to do it.

[00:12:06] If you live in base or you have the ability to pick up OT at your carrier, you're probably going to be better off just doing that. In Max's case where he already had the, all of the, the things in place and, and he had the time off and could kind of build some of that. It did make sense. But I would say for 99% of people, you're going to make more money just flying extra at your own carrier. There are going to be a few exceptions.

[00:12:32] Oh, your buddy's the chief pilot and the airport's down the street and they just need a guy. You can do the, you know, maybe the insurance will let you sit right seat without having to go to sim school. And, you know, you do a couple trips a month. There's always going to be an avenue, but by and large, it makes more sense just to fly for your carrier. Great advice. Love that. So your podcast is not like our podcast and our podcast is not like your podcast.

[00:12:57] Well, I will, I will tell you the funny thing is our podcast has a slogan, which is never take financial advice from a pilot. You know, our intro, the intro to our podcast almost ended up with that slogan. And then the, the follow-up to it in the intro was going to be Ryan. Where do you get it? Where do you get it? Yeah. If you don't take investment advice from a pilot. Yeah, that's great. We hear that all the time, but then where do you get it?

[00:13:26] So our podcast brings on the experts to give it to you. Right. And so we're the dumb pilots that, uh, ask the great questions of the guests that have the expert, that expert knowledge. Right. We're not, we're bringing on tax attorneys, estate attorneys, uh, guy Adami from fast money who knows more about the stock market runs a hedge fund. Right. And I think that's the problem is like, you know, you get into the airlines and people are like, yeah, I don't ever listen to what pilots are doing. We're dummies. Like, yeah, I know. Okay. But where do we actually go and get it?

[00:13:56] You know, some financial advisor that's just trying to get your business and is singular focused on selling you certain products, you know, or, you know, so there's always an angle, right. Right. To what people are trying to do. And so we wanted to, we wanted to create that environment. And so not to go on a tangent about it, but that's kind of our, um, we agree with you is what we're saying. And so like, we wanted to create a community of good education because we all know that we have a lot to learn. And, uh, yeah. So, so yeah. Tell us a little bit more about your show.

[00:14:24] I mean, um, you know, what is it all about and how did it start? Yeah. So when Max and I were both flying in corporate pilots, we were, as Max mentioned, the part 91, sort of the most pure form of, of business aviation, especially when you're a small flight department, maybe it's you, another pilot and your airplane, right? That is the least amount of regulation, um, for pilots that are familiar with 135 and 121. We have continuing education, you going to, um, your recurrent training, AQP, all these

[00:14:54] different things. And then I know your airlines will send out required online training. You've got to do for, for part 91. There is really not much of that. You know, you're going to go to your simulator training about once a year and it's kind of the lowest common denominator stuff. So it's mostly focused on the airplane. It doesn't talk a lot about what else is going on in the industry or with the FAA or regulation wise. So the onus is really on you to stay up.

[00:15:20] And so we would, you know, have conversations, Max and I would about different topics. Um, and oh, runway analysis or whatever, you know, kind of, kind of things we're like, you know, we probably should start to record some of this. If we're struggling to keep up, then I bet there's probably other folks that are too. Yeah. We were actually putting an effort to stay up on current stuff. And by and large, I think the part 91 community, uh, does not. Right. Right. Right. Yeah. And just for those listening.

[00:15:50] So no, nobody left behind. I know we have a lot of listeners that aren't pilots. If you're still hanging on a good job. Um, but, but part 91 is like, if you think of part 91, it's like Dylan was saying, it's not very right. It's regulated, but it's the, probably the loosest regulations for hire. So part 91 is like you own your own, your own airplane. You're taking it from A to B you're operating under part 91. Once you get into one 35, that is charter. So regulations get a lot more strict because you're actually, there's somebody paying for that flight.

[00:16:20] And as soon as you are holding out to the public, the, the regulations get tighter. And then one 21 is the airlines where it's scheduled service. And those are, that's the tightest regulation. Super tight rules. Yeah. Like I fly part night when I go fly my private. But own personal airplane. I have operational control and I'm flying part 91. And so, you know, there's a lot less stringent regulations, uh, imposed upon me. Right. And even in your scenario too, it's the same in GA.

[00:16:47] If you don't stay up on it, you have to make an effort to stay up on that. No one's spoon feeding it to you. So, so yeah, we started that in 2019 and I don't know about you guys, but the first few podcasts are pretty rough. Um, we got some advice from some mentors. They said, record five podcasts and don't listen to any of them because they're just, they're not going to be very good. But, uh, but we enjoyed it. Uh, we, we had a lot of fun.

[00:17:13] We had, uh, a great access to a network of folks that were interesting that would come on the show. And I think, and I'd be curious to hear what you guys have to say. One of the kind of the folks that I looked up to in the podcasting space was, uh, Bill Simmons who does a lot of sports is the ringer. But when they talked about launching shows, they said, the best thing that you can do when you launch a podcast is to have two hosts that have great chemistry and you can overcome

[00:17:41] a lot when you have that, because it's very difficult to have a guest come on with one other person. And they probably have never talked before, or maybe talked for five or 10 minutes. I know you've, we've all listened to the podcast where the first 20 minutes are like, Oh, this is kind of tough. And then it sort of gets better as people build a little bit of rapport and they get some more chemistry and you guys are shaking your heads. Like you've heard this as well. So, so I think for us, it was very helpful to have two hosts and then one guest.

[00:18:08] And then now we can kind of play off each other and the guest and it just makes it a little smoother. So I don't, have you guys figured it, found that to be similar? I've always loved podcasts that have two hosts. In fact, you know, one of the podcasts that I listened to for probably the more, most hours out of any was the bigger pockets podcast back in the day. That's how I got my PhD in real estate when I was young and having two hosts on that show was fantastic. It kept things fresh. And I find that, that having Ryan as a co-host, I mean, it's, it's great because we can just pass the ball back and forth.

[00:18:38] You don't have to be at a hundred percent every time you come onto the show, you know, we back each other up. We also come at questions from different angles. So it's, it, it really makes for a good show. I agree. Nothing further on that. Yeah. It's, it's, it's, it's a game changer for sure. Yeah. And there weren't many folks doing it in, in our space at the time. So I think that was kind of a little bit of a, an edge that we found. And so sort of the first year we were doing a lot of what we talked about, Oh, how, here's what we think we should do with training.

[00:19:07] And let's talk about this interesting topic. And then all of a sudden COVID came around about a year later and everyone's just sitting around and not flying. And so we had a lot, and the career stuff was really starting to pick up. I'm getting furloughed. I don't have a job. I need a new job. So we made a kind of partnered with some career coach folks. So we would kind of see that that was a big need in the space as well to discuss that.

[00:19:37] So 2020 for us, I think was a lot of growth just because everyone was sitting around with nothing to do and everyone needed a job. And there was just endless amounts of things to talk to or talk about. And so that kind of really kickstarted things for us. I know it's kind of funny when we started the show, we had, are we going to run out of things to talk about? What's episode 15 going to be? You guys may have had similar thoughts and then you sort of get there.

[00:20:04] And once the, once the momentum builds, then it's surprising that there's always something to talk about. It seems like. Yeah, I agree. And I feel like we had a lot of topics that we kind of sprayed out in the first 20 episodes and then all of a sudden pilots started giving us feedback like, oh my God, I don't know what depreciation is. I didn't realize that that's a massive tax benefit I can have. And thank you so much for educating me on it. And I'm like, man, I've known what depreciation is for 10 years.

[00:20:31] I didn't realize there's this audience that doesn't know about that. And then we talked, then Tate brought in the short-term rental stuff. And it was like this loophole that gives you a big tax break on buying rentals. And it was like, and that was all of a sudden we had people emailing us and coming to our happy hours and our education events. And they're like, I saved a hundred grand on my taxes this year because of your show. I just did exactly what you, you know, what, what you guys kind of outlined. And it's like, oh, well maybe we should talk about that more.

[00:21:00] You know, like, you know, that's something that, you know, we had a tax attorney come on and he basically said, this is what pilots should do every year. Right. They should buy a short-term rental every year. And this is, this is why. And, um, or he said, I don't know why don't, they don't do it every year. And just, it goes on and on and on, you know, then we got into, you know, the, the just different taxes and strategies around real estate investing, trust and estate planning. And then, and then some stuff like this, like, Hey, let's talk about the career. Uh, let's talk about your medical. I don't know if you guys have had people on with, with, uh, medical, but that is amazing.

[00:21:30] I mean, I, the, the stuff I've learned personally about how to protect your medical from our podcast has been. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. What are, what are your top five favorite subjects that you've covered in the last 213 episodes on the 21 five podcast? Uh, one of my favorite ones was this, uh, dude, I read his book. His name is Roger Reeves, a bit of a polarizing pig figure.

[00:21:55] Uh, but he was the Medellin cartels, uh, like number one drug smuggling pilot for Pablo Escobar. Okay. That sounds like a fun story. So we interviewed him for like, I was like five or six hours. What? No, hold on. We, we loaded up Max's Murphy moose with all of our recording equipment and flew to Santa Barbara. And I was wondering what you were going to be loading up the moose with. I was, Oh, that was the first, he met us at the airport. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:22:21] He was, uh, so it's one thing to live an interesting life like that, but yeah, he was very interested in the cargo capacity. Uh, but, uh, but it's one thing to have a lot of things. Have an interesting life, but it's another thing to be a good storyteller. And when you can combine those two things, that's gold. And so, yeah, Roger Reeves, uh, has a lot of stories and he knows how to tell a story, man. And so that was one that I was, you know, I was probably most excited about. I don't know.

[00:22:49] Just what my other one, I liked, I liked the storytelling dudes that like, just, just, I just like aviation stories tellers. And, uh, um, what's, uh, we've tried to do, you know, I think, yeah. The guy, have you guys ever heard of the keyboard? Nope. Okay. This is like a B 29 that crashed in Greenland and it sat there for 50 years in the tundra. And these dudes flew out to try and fly it out of there. Oh wow. Oh yeah.

[00:23:16] Like it worked on it for two summers and the fluent motor. It just like the craziest story, dude. And I had this guy, I walked into his shop over by the airport where I keep my airplane because I needed an exhaust crack on stainless steel exhaust crack welded. And I look at these pictures on his wall and I'm like, is that the keyboard? Cause it's a big B 29 in the tundra. And I'm like, what else? Cause he goes, yeah, I go, wow. Why do you have a picture of the keyboard on the wall?

[00:23:44] He goes, well, who the hell do you think the guy is in the photo next to it? And it's this dude younger. And he was like the main machinist on this mission, uh, of the keyboard, which is one of the crazy stories originally that I'd ever heard. And so we had him on a tell, you know, and he's another guy, got a lot stuff, a lot of stories to tell and knows how to tell it. And so I think those, the story ones are really cool. We try and interview different pilots that are doing unique or interesting jobs, you know, crop dusting or the Goodyear blimp or just sort of stuff.

[00:24:13] But that's, that's maybe a little, um, off the beaten path. So those I really love. And then I think I would say probably the most rewarding thing for us is definitely that we can help a lot of folks. I think, especially in the career stuff, not that Max and I are any sort of career coach geniuses. Usually we give the wrong advice, but, um, um, our partners will come on, um, Raven careers and they'll come on and they, they just do a really good job of giving great free actionable advice to folks.

[00:24:43] And then we get a lot of listener follow-up. Yeah. Um, and, and so it's spawned this thing that we do called flight advice where people will write in every episode and we attempt to give them advice on their situations. And often we, so I would say sometimes we will actually get a follow-up story and it's always a little nerve wracking when, you know, we stick our necks out and we're like, we think you should do this or here's, or we don't actually try and tell people what to do, but we more give them things to think about.

[00:25:11] Like therapists, you know, give them the, make sure they know the questions they should be asking themselves, you know? And usually it's a happy ending. I don't think we've gotten any really bad. No, we haven't got any, you screwed me emails yet, but, but yeah, those are the ones where we actually, uh, help people. And sometimes, you know, I think we're helping people, but when you get feedback that says you actually help somebody, um, that's the, that's the most rewarding part of the show.

[00:25:36] And that, and at the end of the day, that's why we started this show, um, was to try and do something productive with our experience and things we've learned and try and help people because sometimes in aviation, you know, it's a high stakes game and there are certain things that might, you know, save somebody's life just by knowing something like just knowing how runway performance works or, or just things like that, you know? So, so that was, um, why we started the show.

[00:26:06] And I think that's still the best part. That resonates in such parallel to why we do the show, our show. Uh, but it's in the financial sense and you know, the, the feedback that we get from listeners is so rewarding. It's why we do it and it's taking our experience and giving back to the, to the pilot community, but in a financial sense. So that's, that's fantastic. Yeah. Learn, earn, return, right? That's right. Yeah. It's important. You can't just be a taker all life. You gotta give something back. Yeah.

[00:26:36] And, and it's a lot of fun too, honestly. And I'm sure you guys have a blast doing it too, cause you get to talk to people that you would never normally talk to. Absolutely. How about you? If I flip, flip the script on you guys, do you have a highlight on, on, uh, some of your recent shows? Yeah. I, I mean, I would say the, the highlights are always typically, you know, stuff that gives actionable advice to a pilot.

[00:27:00] So, you know, we, we, we look at every episode and say, how would this impact the mid career captain at Delta airlines or American or United or wherever. Right. And they're flying the line and they're making really good money and they're probably paying more in taxes than they paid. Then they earned it in their entire salary about five or six years ago. Right. Right. And that's a problem.

[00:27:25] And so what actionable advice and wisdom can we get out of our guests that come on the show to help them, you know, mitigate those taxes or, or increase their diversification in a way that's like effective. Right. And I think that's like every show is grounded in that. Like, how can we be impactful to that person? You know, I tend to be like a real big business nerd because I, I run a business with a billion dollars in assets. I have 200 employees.

[00:27:54] I want to hear how like every business was built and I want to kind of get into that, but like, I have to kind of take my business hat off and put on my, I'm an airline pilot. How does this apply to me? Kind of mindset. Because I think pilots over the last decade are accruing more wealth than they have in all of their careers. Right. For most of us that started, you know, around nine 11 learning how to fly. We're now all of a sudden in this massive earning potential.

[00:28:22] And so how do you mitigate tax? How do you diversify your returns? How do you build kind of a barbell strategy of passive income from real estate or tax advantaged investments and how to really harness the power of the, what you can do within the tax code to best position yourself for an awesome retirement. And then also now you've got this new wealth that you're going to have, that you're going to have to pass on generationally to kids. So how do I protect that? Right.

[00:28:52] How, what do I, what kind of mechanisms do I have to do to protect that wealth? And then what are some philosophical thoughts on how to pass it to my kids? Do I give it to them all when they're 18? Do I give it to them all when they're 25? Do I never give it to them? Do I give it to them under certain conditions being met? But so there's just all kinds of different things that we don't think about as, or maybe we have, you know, group think as we talk to our fellow co-pilots in the, in the flight deck, right? Like, it's like, they're not, they don't really know.

[00:29:18] You don't really know to your point earlier on the show, like never get investment advice from a pilot. Cause it's like, we both don't know, right? We don't both really know. So let's, let's have a, let's have an ecosystem where we can share that. So I think the best episodes hit those topics really well, you know, and we've had some guests, some amazing tax attorneys on, and I would say probably our most downloaded episode is, is a tax attorney coming onto the show and talking about the different types of tax

[00:29:45] you pay and how to change your, your lifestyle to kind of have a better tax efficiency. And also people like, like we have shows about how to start a flight school, how to depreciate an airplane, how to buy an airplane and lease it back to a school, the business of kind of aviation and how you can participate in it. Cause like we like investing in things, you know, as pilots, we were familiar with flight schools. We understand how it works, right? We understand students come and they rent and we understand the supply and the demand. So how can we be on the business side of that and take advantage of the tax code and

[00:30:14] take advantage of the income that you can produce from something like that and be around something you kind of enjoy. Yeah. It's so interesting to dive into the metrics there of the episodes. And sometimes you are surprised. I would imagine when you're saying, Oh, we had a tax specialist on you would, you would like to pitch that to somebody and be like, that's not going to do that well. But it's funny when you look and you see, wow, this is resonating with people. And that's the beauty of podcasting. I think is that we have some feedback in the numbers and you can, you can kind of see that

[00:30:44] and then be able to craft a strategy. So that's really interesting. Yeah. But then when you think about it, you know, pilots were all cheap, high earners that are on a W2 income, uh, you know, and you see the taxes, every paycheck and you're like, this is in your hands, you know, and everybody feels handcuffed because it's, that's a tough, tough spot to be in. So it's not about what you make. It's about what you keep. Right. And if you're giving it all the way to the government and the taxes, like. Yeah. Well, and to piggyback on what Ryan's saying, you know, it's funny.

[00:31:14] Pilots love to talk about how much money they make. Right. And nobody ever talks about the net. They always talk about that gross number and nobody ever talks about what they actually took home. And I think one of the biggest problems with, you know, not just pilots, but physicians, surgeons, you know, any of these really high paying W2 jobs, even attorneys is they don't teach you how to manage five, six, $700,000 a year of W2 income in medical school.

[00:31:44] They don't teach you in flight school. And so all of a sudden you get dumped into this career and the only real financial advice you've ever been given is max out your 401k. Well, guess what? You can't even max out your 401k if you're a Delta pilot making a half million dollars a year because the company already does it. And you won't, you don't even have the full allocation to put in the full tax deferral amount because the company's already stuffed so much in, they took up most of the room.

[00:32:10] And so I think a lot of pilots end up in their, you know, mid forties to early fifties, looking at their pay stub going, there's gotta be, I must be missing something here. Like there has to be some missing information that I haven't been given. And that just opens up Pandora's box. You know, Ryan, like you were saying, it's like, it's tax mitigation. It's trust and estate planning. It's, you know, utilizing real estate and depreciation to offset taxes.

[00:32:39] It's creating passive income streams through investing in alternative assets. It's all these things that we never really learned in school. And that oftentimes wealthy families will teach their kids. But when you're from, you know, middle-class, like, like, I don't know, most, most pilots that I know come from, from middle-class families that don't really know these things. And it's not like they're secrets. It's just that you have to go searching for them. There's hundreds, thousands of books on this, this stuff.

[00:33:07] So if you really dig in the information's there, it's just, we're trying to, you know, like Ryan said, create that ecosystem and create a platform that it's easily digestible. And it's a one-stop shop for a lot of this information. We can give people the picks and shovels to, to build their own financial success. Yeah. And if you think about the amount of money going into the 401k, right? It's awesome. It's maxed out on the airlines, right? So if you're a new pilot listening to this and you're like, well, I'm just a flight instructor.

[00:33:37] Like you're going to have a massive 401k at some point, right? From the airlines. This is great. This is an awesome thing. And you don't have to put any money into it, but here's the thing that's going to inflate. That balloon is going to get really big, right? And you're going to have all this money in there. And then you got to hope that when you hit 65 and you start withdrawing that money, that there's enough in there to sell off your assets, to live like a deflating balloon until you're in your eighties or nineties.

[00:34:06] And don't forget, you're not going to know what rate it's taxed at either when you're 65 because who knows? And that's all, that's all the big question mark. And so we try to bring on people that help you diversify. So if you have stuff like real estate in your portfolio, where the real estate could continue to appreciate instead of, and provide you with money every month, cashflow. So now you get into retirement and instead of this deflating balloon of a stock market,

[00:34:34] you know, withdraw a 401k and oh my God, I hope the market doesn't change at all. You've got this other thing over here that's producing income every month and appreciating, and you can have tax deferral strategies flowing off of it. And you can hand it to your heirs or your kids in a way that they don't pay taxes on it either versus handing them a stock account where they're going to have to have some kind of distribution, right? Mandatory distributions on it.

[00:35:03] If they give the inherited IRA or something like that, they've got 10 years to basically deplete it. So there's so many things you can do. And it's like, you know, to your point, like what Tate was saying, like, you don't, you don't learn this anywhere. And we want to present the information through the eyes of pilots. You know, I was an airline pilot, uh, for over 17 years. Tate's an airline pilot for, I guess now going on probably 20 years, almost Tate, right? Something like that.

[00:35:32] 16, but who's counting? I really don't fly much anymore. Yeah. Yeah. So, so, I mean, we are both airline pilots and we have the perspective of the career and kind of know what we don't know. And so that's the gap we fill. Right. And so those episodes that are heavy hitting are basically those kinds of kind of kind of shows. And, and it's amazing. Like you said, Dylan, the reward or, um, Max was saying is too, like when people write

[00:35:58] in and say, I saved a hundred thousand dollars this year on taxes because of you, because of your show. I mean, we've, we've had, we had a Southwest captain come on and basically tell everybody like, Hey, I started listening to the show. I listened to every episode and I've saved hundreds of thousands of dollars on my taxes. And, you know, it's like, and so we're like, Hey, will you come on and like tell everybody that? Cause like, you know, and people think, Oh, we're going to get audited or, you know, Oh, it's, this is a scam or this is, it's like, no, this is just the tax.

[00:36:25] You, this is like looking at the FARs, reading the FARs and doing what they say. Right. And some FARs, you know, we have to be attorneys as pilots sometimes and have to kind of interpolate what's going on and what, what you can really do and what not do. That's what the experts are for. That's why you get legal opinions or tax opinions. And here's a big problem too. Like some people might be like, well, I went to my, my CPA and they told me that, um, you know, that I can't do this or they don't. You're making so much money. Yeah. Right. Yeah.

[00:36:55] Or you guys shouldn't, you know, and it's like you getting the wrong advice. So like we bring on CPAs that understand pilots, understand real estate, understand the tax code or a little bit more advanced. And that provides the pilots a great platform for success and actually talking to the right people. Tate and I have talked to a lot of wrong people, right? We've made a lot of mistakes and we're basically sharing all the, you know, avoiding those mistakes by talking about the right advice, you know, on the show. So.

[00:37:23] Well, that's the tough part about this business too, because for a lot of folks, especially airline pilots, they are, you were flying with a new captain or a new first officer every week. And as we all know, pilots love to talk about money and how much money they're making and what they're doing to make money. And so you're stuck in this little room with a guy for a week or a gal, and they're telling you about how great it is there, you know, whatever their options trading strategy is or whatever. And by the end of the trip, you're either like this person is a genius or, or they're crazy,

[00:37:53] but you can really be led astray quickly. So probably both. Yeah. Most of the time. And I think the, the important thing to realize too, is that, uh, when you're saying, Oh, you saved a hundred thousand dollars in taxes, right? Well, the difference between airline pilots and corporate pilots is a corporate pilot. You're paid. You're typically on salary. You're paid to be available to fly, right? You're not necessarily paid to fly. Cause it, you fly a hundred hours or 500 hours. Your salary doesn't change. Right. As an airline pilot, you're paid to fly.

[00:38:20] So every dollar you make, it's cause you had to be in an airplane spending another night away from your family or whatever. And so when you take that a hundred thousand dollars, you didn't give to uncle Sam and put that in time. That's a huge deal. Like for me personally, you know, that's what I have a quote. I always like to say is that, that money is not the prime asset time is. Absolutely. But they're interchangeable, right? Especially as an airline pilot, cause you're paid by the hour to fly jets.

[00:38:46] And so a hundred thousand bucks is a lot of, a lot of time spent away from the people you care about and doing the things you actually want to be doing, which might also be flying airplanes, but probably a different one. When you got to remember that, you know, the internal revenue codes, what? 10,000 pages long. There's only about 10, 10 pages of that book that actually talks about how to pay taxes. The rest of it is how not to pay taxes and no CPA, no tax attorney can know every nook and cranny of the internal revenue code.

[00:39:16] There's, there are specialists, right? And so your typical H&R block CPA isn't going to know anything about business depreciation, aircraft write-offs, uh, utilizing real estate bonus depreciation, real estate professional status, short-term rental loopholes, that sort of thing. So you need to, you need to be working with a CPA who understands these, these loopholes that are available for high income W2 professionals. They're not a whole lot of them. Uh, but if you're working with either TurboTax or a, or a CPA that is, you know, tooled more

[00:39:46] for the a hundred thousand dollar a year person, they're not going to be familiar with these strategies. Well, and I think it's important always to like, dude, whether that's with your finances or your tax planning or your health, like you have to be your own advocate. You can't just show up and say, Hey, like nobody cares about your stuff like you do. And so you have to be your own advocate, whether that's with your heart doctor or your accountant, like you have to educate yourself and go in there, um, loaded with knowledge and questions.

[00:40:15] And a lot of this is, is educating yourself to a point where you can have an intelligent conversation with your heart doctor. Right. Right. So, so with your cardiologist, you, it doesn't mean that you need to become a cardiologist. You still need the cardiologist. Right. But you want to be able to have an intelligent conversation with them by knowing enough of the baseline information that when they say this, you can say, okay, I understand what you're saying. What about this, this aspect? It's the same thing with, with tax planning.

[00:40:40] If you don't know anything and you're, and even if you have a great tax strategist and they're like, you should use the short-term rental loophole. And you're like, what's that? They don't, they're not getting paid to spoon feed you that strategy and tell you exactly how to do it and which house to buy and how to furnish it and how to get it on. You know, it's like you, you have to, you have to educate yourself. And then, and then that tax professional can help you with the nuts and bolts of making sure that it comes through your tax return. And also there might be someone out there who was like, I have no interest in owning

[00:41:10] rentals. Right. Right. And, and so, or I have no interest in, in being active in real estate and like our podcast kind of helped you have other ways to do it. Exactly. You can invest passively in real estate, you know, uh, and Tate and I talk a lot about that, but then it's like, now there's a lot of options. Like, who do you go with? What's the due diligence on it? How do you vet these people? And also like framing your mindset. Like, do you want to be an active or passive investor in real estate?

[00:41:36] Like there's, you can go both roads and you know, it just kind of helps you sort of frame like, like listing all these options of what you can do, learning a little bit about each one and then deciding like, okay, which one's for me, right? Which one do I actually want to like go down the road and try? Cause you know, a CPA might have some great advice for you on how to save taxes, but you have no interest in going down that road because you just don't want that lifestyle. And that was, that was my big awakening was I went out and bought a bunch of, you know,

[00:42:06] I wanted to get into real estate. You know, I was, I was flying the airlines. I was reading books. I was like, Oh, this is great. I want to get in real estate. So I went out and bought a bunch of rentals and I hated it. It was awful. I made really good money, but it was a terrible return on life because I was like spending all this time on all these things I didn't want. And you know, the light bulb went off and I was like, I bet you there's a lot of pilots out here that would love to be in real estate, but not do all this work I'm doing. And that's why Tate and I, you know, launched our respective companies is to provide those

[00:42:32] passive investment opportunities for mostly pilots that want to be in real estate, but don't want to have the burden that I went through. Cause I'm like, I don't, I hate this. I might, my property managers calling me and they're asking me what I want to do about. And I'm like, I don't got time for this stuff. I want to go home, spend time with the family. I want to enjoy my layover, whatever, whatever it was. And so, but I like this tax strategy and I like these returns. So, so how do I get that without having to do the work? I don't know guys.

[00:42:58] I think most pilots really like to buy depreciating assets, you know, like most, most tech pilots are more interested in depreciating stuff. Like, but you know, boats, cars, airplanes, yeah. And you know, things like that. Speaking of which, let's talk about your carbon cub. This is really going to resonate. Yeah. Hey, listen, I'll have, you know, that the carbon cub and the Cirrus are the slowest depreciating airplanes that, that are on the market. So I love that. I love that. Not, not a Cessna one 85. No, no, no, no. There's those. Yeah.

[00:43:28] No, those are certainly, I mean, by manufacturer, but yeah, Cessnas are doing good. I love hearing about, about, uh, the, the captain's Rolex that keeps going up in value. Like, yeah, sure. Yeah. So what's your exit strategy then on that role? That's what I always say. I'm like, really? So when are you planning on divesting that, uh, Rolex? Well, never. I'm going to give it to my kids. Oh. It does feel good though. Let's talk about what kind of investing you guys do. What do you guys like to do to generate passive income or, or kind of where, what is your portfolio like?

[00:43:58] Yeah, mine's easy. Um, you know, I'm just a huge fan of the public sector. Um, I think the government is, is a great resource. I don't know why you are, guys are so down on paying taxes. I think the social security system is, is awesome. Sorry, you're breaking up. We can't hear you. Sorry. The ultimate passive income strategy is, is social security. So I think, uh, that should be it. Just show up and mailbox money. Right. I mean, that's what you guys say. That's right. Like you said, don't take investment advice on a pilot.

[00:44:27] Exactly. Yeah, it is. I'll tell you, you know, it's funny because I, I also managed a rental early on and I was like, this is not for me. It is a real challenge. And, um, yeah, the phone rings at inconvenient times. And I think, especially if you're an airline pilot, I think one of the greatest beauties of the job is when you're off, you're off. The phone's not ringing there.

[00:44:53] Um, and, and so those are, when you have those rentals and other real estate problems, that is, that's the pain. So, so for me, I, I was kind of soured on real estate from that point of view, you know, managing it myself. Um, and so explored many different things. I kind of consider myself a digital native and enjoy working in the digital space. So, you know, the, when I was doing the podcast, that was super interesting to me.

[00:45:21] And then I've really focused, uh, a lot of my attention on the digital assets. Right. And that has been extremely volatile, as you've seen, probably most of, um, you know, you hear terms about crypto and then sort of Bitcoin is sort of just being distilled there. And that's, I think, very fascinating, but also very, very difficult for most people to grasp. And I don't know, I, I've seen a couple of your episodes. It looks like you, you've kind of touched on that space a little bit.

[00:45:51] Is that, uh, is that true? Very, very likely. Yeah. Yeah. And the CEO of constellation network on, um, a while back talking about it. Yeah. So to me, very interesting and learning about that space has been very engaging for me. So that's where I focus a lot of attention and it is certainly not a space that I would recommend for people that are just want to dabble in it. Um, but I do see a future there.

[00:46:18] And, and I think the other interest I have is also in AI and where that's going. And I don't know what you guys are looking at there. It's, it's a, another sort of, I feel like we're in the, you guys are old enough to remember when the internet launched, right? And they're like, Oh, it's kind of the, the, the dot com bubble. And everyone goes, the internet, every, the internet is going to solve every problem. And, and, you know, pets.com is incredible. And we're going to pay a billion dollars for it. And I feel like that's where we're at.

[00:46:45] May I right now is sort of, it's, it's going to do all of these things. And the, and the truth is, you know, it's going to be just like the web where, yeah, it is going to be a huge part of what we do, but we're going to have a lot of ups and downs to figure that out. So those interest me. And so I think to me, it's, it's what I enjoy researching and yes, it's going to have a different profile and maybe tax advantages and other things that, that some of the investments that you talk about.

[00:47:13] But I think at the end of the day, uh, the lessons I've learned is I've got to be engaged in it and want to be doing it. Um, so makes it much easier. Yeah. If you want to be, if you want to be there. Um, but yeah, so what I do, um, when I was a corporate, almost the entire, um, I Well, when I left the regionals, right. And I, after a year and some change and I was like, this sucks. And so I went and I got a corporate job and then it was, it was easy. I like had to fly, I don't know, five or six days a month.

[00:47:42] And so I was like, Oh, this is great. And it's laying by the pool. And about 30 days after that, I'm like, okay, I can't do this anymore. Like I, I'm, I have to be productive. And so, so I went, actually went to real estate school and got a real estate license. And so I sold real estate for, I've had a real estate license for like 20 years now, maybe something like that. Oh, wow. Um, and so I used to sell like, uh, 20 plus houses a year while flying a full-time corporate job. Um, so I learned a lot about real estate and I was a land researcher, uh, and for, so we'd

[00:48:12] sell land to, um, like home building companies and stuff and scare up, you know, sell farms to home building companies, kind of that deal. Um, so I learned about a lot about real estate there, but I also, um, got really burned out being a real estate agent because similar to babysitting a ton of rental properties, it's babysitting a bunch of people that are buying rental properties or houses for themselves. And so using what I learned over all those years and now just, I like flying airplanes. That's my preferred job, quote unquote.

[00:48:41] Um, and so I still do, um, things in real estate and, and buy houses and add value. And, and, you know, I just, just bought one that is like a second home, but under value and, and remodeling and stuff for, and then I'll get bored and move on and it'll, it'll, it usually works out pretty good. But then also, um, I invest a lot in the stock market, um, in kind of different buckets, you know, outside of my set it, forget it money, 401k, things like that.

[00:49:09] And then I have a, a Roth that I trade a little bit more aggressively just in equities, you know, and, and stocks. And then I have another account, which is my, um, aggressive account that I have an investment group. And we, we trade, um, stocks and options a lot on tech space. Um, so we trade a lot on earnings and, and, and focused mostly in tech.

[00:49:33] So we follow tech very closely from a lot of different sources and, and, uh, that's been pretty successful. Well, Max, we forgot to bring up our most lucrative, uh, investment of all of this podcast, which is the podcast, of course, as you guys know. Oh yes. Oh yes. The highest return on my time. That's the big moneymaker. Huge moneymaker. Um, well, I'll never forget, you know, when we got our first sponsorship, um, which you, you'd mentioned medicals, uh, before.

[00:50:00] So our very first sponsor was Harvey Watt, who does, uh, the loss of license insurance. And I remember you called me Max and you're like, well, I guess we're professional podcasters now because, and, you know, it was enough to cover the hosting and basically kind of make the show break even. And they've been with us, um, I think for seven years now, which is incredible, but it was, it was very rewarding to be able to make it from where this was coming out of pocket to now it is cashflow positive.

[00:50:29] We have a producer, we have some, some support and the engine sort of can keep going. So, you know, we're never going to retire because of the show, but it is nice to be able to have everything covered for it and we can, you know, make merch and, you know, kind of do that kind of stuff. So what have you guys found on the podcast side? Um, has there been, does it, does it break even for you or is it just more of an avenue for, for a funnel for other things or what have you seen? Yeah, I would probably say more of the latter.

[00:50:58] I mean, I would say that we kind of use our company resources to run the show, to be honest, uh, respectively. Um, we have a marketing guy that works for Spartan Investment Group, which is my company that does a lot of the marketing assets. Uh, Tate likewise has, uh, Brittany who runs a lot of the things, uh, we pay a little bit for post-production, um, you know, have it edited and professionally done. But, you know, for us, I think it's, you know, it's really just, it's started in the right, you know, I think just like you guys, our show started from the right frame of like mindset, right.

[00:51:28] Which is, and I think that's so critical. I mean, you know, you can talk to these gurus about why to start a podcast, how to do it, you know, how many episodes you need to pre-record, what you need to do, how often it needs to be, I think all that is great. And there's probably some great advice out there, but I think what's most important is you got to start it because you really want to do it. Yeah. Yes. And you just got to ignore everything. Like anybody, everybody's going to have advice for you because people will listen, like Tate

[00:51:55] and I, people listen to our show that are not pilots and they're like, why do you call it passive income pilots? This is for anybody who's got a high net worth, uh, or high income job that would benefit. Why do you like, don't just do it for that. But the reason why it's special is because it is for pilots. Right. Right. And that's what makes the niche that much better. Cause there's a million financial education podcasts out there. You go on iTunes and search, you know, like financial advice and you'll find a million things.

[00:52:23] And like, how do you differentiate between what you're doing? So I would say pick a niche, go super narrow, you know, um, just like you guys did. You're like, man, this 91 world is a little wild west. Like, it'd be cool to have like a platform to just share what we're doing. It wasn't like, we're going to scale this to a million downloads and, and have sponsors. And then we're going to like live a lavish note. Like, that's not what you did. Like you started from the right place, which is like, Hey, we have all this value. We want to share with the world, you know?

[00:52:51] And that it's like the whole Zig Ziglar quote, right? Like if you want to be successful, help, help a million other people and you'll be successful. And, or I think I just butchered that quote, but you'll understand the point. It's just like, give, give, give, and you shall receive. I think it's, uh, you can have anything you want if you help enough people get what they want. Wow. That was much better said. And, uh, and you know, Ryan, your company and my company, Turbine Capital are both very investment focused.

[00:53:19] Um, you know, I, I run a, a large alternative investment firm. Ryan, your firm is focused on, on self-storage real estate, huge, uh, firm. You, you're how, what number are you in the country now? We're the 29th largest of 29th largest self-storage owner and operator in America. And that's, that's including like public storage, the, the big REITs, right? Yeah. Yeah. They're like top five, but yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, we, we both run very successful firms.

[00:53:48] We wanted, we wanted passive income pilots to be this, this neutral ground in between our two companies that isn't selling anything that isn't pitching anything. There's nothing for sale. And that just is a, a free unbiased education platform because that really was, when we look out into the aviation landscape, there was really this missing link of financial education in the space. No one was talking to the airline pilot community about these more advanced tax strategies.

[00:54:18] Trust and estate planning, asset protection, that sort of thing. And we really just wanted to provide that on a silver platter to the aviation community. And it really has, has taken off like wildfire because it's, it didn't exist a few years ago. So we're, we're very honored to have the listenership that we do and that people, you know, that, that people tune in. And so that's, that's who we are. It really is. The, the niche is, is so key that sort of the inspiration to start the podcast was I

[00:54:48] was picking up my kids from daycare and talking to one of the other parents there. I was picking up their kid and, and you know, oh, what do you do? Kind of a thing. And he said, you know, I just sold my pool maintenance company because we started a podcast for people that maintain pools and we make way more money doing a podcast for pool maintainers than we ever made maintaining pools. And, and he goes, the niche is just the key.

[00:55:15] And that's the really cool, you know, Max, you we've talked about Peter Thiel's book zero to one, you know, and it's just like you start, there's nothing. And then you create something that doesn't exist. Like you guys said, and that's the beauty of living in this digital age that we're in is that there is no barrier to entry besides buying a couple of microphones and paying some hosting fees. So anybody can do this. And if you're good and you're providing value, then you can build a platform and you don't

[00:55:44] need anybody's permission to do it. And I think that's awesome. Um, so we can, can have these niche shows and, and, um, that's what I think is, is so fun and rewarding. So like you look at what your kids watch, right? Right. Like Mark Rober, um, you know, Ninja kids, right? These are like random people who are like, Hey, I'm going to just do this YouTube channel thing. And now they're like on Netflix and look at Mr. Beast. That guy is the biggest beast on the planet.

[00:56:15] I'm like, how is this? Why do people care about this dude? But then, but then I've like, why, you know, which is like me walking past when my kids are walking. I'm like, I cannot take this dude in this straw hat, you know, talking about nonsense. But then you sit down and you watch it and like, shit, this is entertaining. Like this is, this is entertaining. I'm actually into this. I watched a little bit of Mark Rober the other day with my son. And I was like, this is really educational. Have you seen that? It's incredible. It's good. Yeah. Yeah. It's really good.

[00:56:43] And it's like, yeah, you didn't have to like pitch somebody in Hollywood to do that. You just started doing it. You know, you used to hear about movie stars who'd like, okay, I'll do the big budget movie. If you let me do my passion project thing, you know, and that used to be the kind of the give and take of, of creatives. And now it's like, nah, just do your passion project. And if, and you know, if it resonates with folks, it'd be fine. And so that's what I think is great. And I don't know how much longer we're going to keep pushing record max, but we're still having fun doing it.

[00:57:12] So right until we get AI to take over and we don't have to show up. That's right. We can do robots. Figure the robots. But yeah, it said. Well, for our listeners, check out the 21 five podcast. I can't wait to, to start tuning in a little bit more to you guys. And for the 21 five listeners, come check us out. I will also give a shameless plug that October 8th and 9th in Las Vegas, Nevada for the first ever passive income pilots conference.

[00:57:39] So if you're interested in trust and estate planning and asset protection and all that sort of stuff, we're going to be there learning about all that stuff. So come check us out. Passive income pilots.com. Guys, I want to ask you one question there for our listeners that may not be familiar. What's the episode you point folks to if they're first, you start at episode one, or is there, is there one you would say, Hey, this is a great place to start. Go to episode 10, Toby Mathis.

[00:58:07] He's a tax attorney and it'll blow your mind. And that's a, that's a really great way to pop open Pandora's box. Yeah. 10 and 14 are good. You know, I would say, you know, some of the episodes that solo episodes that Tate and I do, we talk about like, Hey, if you're a new hire at an airline. There are some major things you can take advantage of that nobody will tell you about an in doc and like that you'll learn that on our show, right?

[00:58:34] I won't give it away, but you know, like there's some major opportunity. Like if you're a new pilot about to get hired by another airline, there are like five to 10 things you can do that you didn't realize. And I think that's what you're going to take away from our show. If you're a 50 year old, um, middle of seniority list captain, there are things you can do right now to save you hundreds of thousands of dollars. And so I just think that, you know, that's our show. And unfortunately I can't say like, go to that one.

[00:59:03] And yeah, go to that one episode because it just, it's a journey, right? Cause it's, it's bolting on a lot of different things and perspectives that kind of make it all together. But I do think I agree with Tate 10 episode 10, probably episode 14 would be a nice, like, Oh my God, I didn't know I could do any of this stuff. Uh, coming right from the mouth of an attorney. Sweet. Well, thanks so much guys. This has been fun. I know it's been a lot of time in the works getting this coordinated. We've been circling each other. Always the hardest part of pilot podcasts. Yeah.

[00:59:32] It's getting the scheduling figured out. That's right. Four schedules. Well, thank you again. Uh, it's, it's been an absolute blast. So hope to see you guys in person sometime. Thanks everyone for listening and we'll catch you on the next episode. All right. Thanks guys. See you guys. Well, thanks again, everybody for listening to the show. Before you leave, don't forget we're meeting for the PIP live events in October 8th and 9th in Las Vegas, Nevada.

[00:59:59] If you enjoy our content, what you're hearing, what we're talking about, and you want to network with other pilots that are doing what you're doing, tax and legal and investment professionals. See you in Las Vegas. Go to passiveincomepilots.com to get your tickets. Ticket prices do go up in August. So jump on that as soon as you can. Thanks everybody.